Final Session – Shakespeare’s “Richard II” – the king deposed (Act 4, Sc 1) – The Rehearsal Room [Video, Audio, and Transcript versions]

Final Session – Richard II – The King Deposed – The Rehearsal Room

Nathan: I’m Nathan Agin Welcome back to the Working Actors Journey rehearsal room. We are in our third and final session for Shakespeare’s Richard II, Act 4, Scene 1. Tonight. it was a bit of an abbreviated session, this round. So actually I’m going to try to make my comments very brief at the top so that we can get right into the work. I’ll just say, you know, if you’re watching and you haven’t seen the other weeks go back, you’re going to take away and learn so much more. What’s also been really cool about this session is both Nick and Jamal have been kind of trading the roles of Richard and Bolingbroke. So you can see different takes on that. and, you know, leave questions, leave comments, on the YouTube video, and we’ll try to get to those as best we can. M. If you’d like to support the project, you can do that through Patreon. There are links below. we are still figuring out, our next session in January. Taking a little bit of break for the holidays. but, but that’s. That’s where we’re at. Quick thank you and shout out to some of our patrons. Ebar, Joan, Michelle, Jim Magdalene, Claudia, Cliff and Jeff. Thank you so much for your support. and, that is it. I will just kind of let the group get right into their work. I’ll come back at the end for a little Q and A and we’ll wrap it up then. So, guys, have a great session with, Richard ii and I’ll see you at the end.

Will: all right, friends, excited to dive back in. Jamal, beautiful work, last week. Nick, beautiful work last week. And now we’re going to turn the mirror around and see what happens when we mix it up. So Nick is playing King Richard this week. Jamal’s playing Bolingbroke. I am subjecting everyone to my Northumberland in York. so before we. I mean, I want us to get a dive into the text and get a proper read at the scene. But before we do that, Nick, Jamal, anything that you wanted to talk about before we dive into the text or just dive into a read?

Nick: I have. I have learned so much since last week in looking at this and during this session, with everybody that I have a ton of things to say. So I don’t know whether or not you’d rather me say them after we read. Or maybe we’ll read first and then discuss.

Will: Let’s read first, because the only other thing I want to Say is, Jamal, you did beautiful work last week. But also, I want to encourage us. I think I said this last week as well. let’s take what’s useful from last week, but then let’s also, approach today with a blank slate. So then the exercise is, Nick, let’s see how this is resonating, off of you. And, Jamal, let’s see how this is resonating off of you. So let’s. Let’s go ahead and dive in. And then, Nick, let’s unpack everything. so, whenever you’re ready. Nick, go ahead and take us away.

Nick: Alack, why am I sent for to a king? Before I have shook off the regal thoughts wherewith I reigned, I hardly yet have learned to insinuate. Flower, bow and bend my knee Give sorrow, leave awhile to tutor me to this submission. Yet I well remember the favors of these men. Were they not mine? Did they not sometime cry, all hail to me? So Judas did to Christ. But he in 12 found truth in all but one I, in 12,000 none. God saved the king. Will no man say amen? Am I both priest and clerk? Well, then.

Will: Amen.

Nick: God save the king. And though I be not he, and yet, amen. If heaven do think him me, what service am I sent for hither to.

Will: Do that office of thine own good will, which tired majesty did make thee offer the resignation of thy state and crown to Henry Bolingbroke.

Nick: Give me the crown. Here, cousin, seize. the crown. Here, cousin on this side, my hand on that side vine. Now this golden cup is like a deep well that owes two buckets, filling one another, the emptier ever dancing in the air, the other down unseen

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Nick: and full of water. That bucket down and full of tears, drinking my griefs whilst you mount up on high.

Jamal: I thought you had been willing to resign my crown.

Nick: I am. But still my griefs are mine. You may my glories and my state depose, but not my grief. Still am I king of those part.

Jamal: Of your cares you give me with.

Nick: Your crown your cares set up. do not pluck my cares down. My care is loss of care by old care. Done. Your care is gain of care by new care. 1. The cares I give I have though given away. They tend the crown, yet still with me they stay.

Jamal: Are you contented to resign the crown?

Will: Aye.

Nick: No. Nope. Aye. For I must nothing be, therefore. No, no. For I resign to thee. Now mark me how I will undo myself. I give this heavy weight from off my head, and this unwieldy scepter from my hand, the pride of kingly sway from out my heart, and with mine own tears I wash away my balm. With mine own hands I give away my crown. With mine own tongue deny my sacred state. With mine own breath release all duteous oaths, all pomp and majesty Ado, forswear my manners, rents, revenues I forego. My acts, decrees and statutes I deny. God pardon all oaths that are broke. To me God keep, All vows unbroke are made to thee make me that nothing have with nothing grieved, and thou, withal pleased, that hast all achieved. Long mayst thou live in Richard’s seat to sit, and soon lie, Richard in an earthly earthy pit. God saved King Henry, unking’d, Richard says, and sent him many years of sunshine days. What more remains?

Will: No more, but that you read these accusations and these grievous crimes committed by your person and your followers against the state and profit of this land, that by confessing them, the souls of men may deem that you are worthily deposed.

Nick: Must I do so? And must I ravel out my weaved up follies? Gentle Northumberland, if thy offences were upon record, would it not shame thee in so fair a troop to read a lecture of them? If thou wouldst, thou shouldst find one heinous article containing the deposing of a king, the cracking of the strong warrant of an oath, marked with a blot, damned in the book of heaven. Nay, all of you that stand and look upon me whilst at my wretchedness doth bate myself, though some of you with Pilate wash your hands, showing in outward pity, yet, you pilots have here delivered me to my sour cross. And water cannot wash away your sin.

Will: My lord, dispatch, read o’er these articles.

Nick: Mine eyes are full of tears, I cannot see. Yet salt water blinds them not so much, but they can see. Sort of traitors here. Nay, if I turn mine eyes upon myself, I find myself a traitor with the rest. For I have given here my soul’s consent. T undeck the pompous body of a king made, glory base, and sovereignty a, slave, proud majesty, a subject state.

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Will: A, peasant, my lord.

Nick: No, lord of thine thou, insulting man, nor no man’s lord. I have no name, no title? No, not that name was given me at the font, but tis usurped. Alack, the heavy day that I have worn so many winters out. And no, not how, no, not now what name to call myself. Oh, that I were a Mockery, King of snow, standing before the sun of Bolingbroke. To melt myself away in water drops. Good king. Great king. King, yet not greatly good. And if my word be sterling, yet in England let it command a mirror hither straight. That it may show me what a face I have. Since it is bankrupt of, his majesty.

Jamal: Go, some of you, and fetch a looking glass.

Will: Read o’er this paper while the glass doth come.

Nick: Fiend, thou torments me ere I come to hell.

Jamal: Urge it no more, my Lord Northumberland.

Will: The commons will not then be satisfied.

Nick: They shall be satisfied. I’ll read enough when I do see the very book indeed where all my sins are writ, and that’s myself. Give me that glass, and therein will I read no deeper wrinkles yet. Hath sorrow struck so many blows upon this face of mine and made no deeper wounds? O flattering glass, like to my followers in prosperity, thou dost become guile me. Was this the face that every day under his household roof did keep 10,000 men? Was this the face that, like the sun, did make beholders wink? Is this the face which faced so many follies. That was at last out faced by. By Bowling Brook? A brittle glory shineth in this face. As brittle as the glory is the face, for there it is cracked in a hundred shivers. Mark, silent king, the moral of this sport. How soon my sorrow hath destroyed my face.

Jamal: The shadow of your sorrow hath destroyed the shadow of your face.

Nick: Say that again. The shadow of my sorrow.

Nick: Let’s see. Tis very true. My grief lies all within. And these external manners of laments are merely shadows of the unseen grief that swells with silence. In the tortured soul. There lies the substance. And thank thee, King, for thy great bounty. That not only gifts me the cause to wail. But teaches me the way how to lament the cause. I’ll beg one boon, and then I’ll be gone and trouble you no more. Shall I obtain it? Name it.

Jamal: Fair cousin.

Nick: Fair cousin, I am greater than a king. For when I was king, my flatterers were then but subjects. And now, being now a subject, I have a king here to my flatter. Being so great, I have nothing to make yet ask and shall I have.

Jamal: You shall.

Nick: Then give me leave to go whither. Whither you will so I were from your sights.

Jamal: Go, some of you. Convey him to the tower.

Nick: Oh, good. Convey, conveyors. Are you all that rise thus nimbly by, a true king’s fall?

Jamal: On Wednesdays next, we solemnly set down our coronation Lords, prepare yourselves.

Will: Good, good. Excellent read, you two. Really excellent. Also, forgive me, my cat, has woken up and is trying to groom my arm off.

Jamal: the cat has to wake up and

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Jamal: do that. So, you know.

Will: Yeah, really wonderful work. I want to work backwards slightly. Well, I want to do the same thing that I did last week. So, Jamal, I want to check in with Bolingbroke first. First and just see how, I guess how that was receiving the walls of text as opposed to delivering those walls of text. Oh, it’s heavy.

Jamal: It comes at you like a ton of books because there’s a transference of power. And regardless of who you are, if you’ve never sat in the seat of King, this is a becoming. And he’s walking into something he has never been.

Jamal: And so receiving all of this and then observing all of this going through Richard, there’s parts that he feels. There’s parts of him that are like, what has become of you? There are parts of him that doesn’t know if he’s, well, okay. Or sanely here. And he is taking this seat regardless of any of that. And so there’s like this. Not a suppression, but there’s this stillness that I’m feeling while receiving all of the weight that is just true sitting in these seats that most of us will never reach.

Will: Yeah.

Jamal: So I just feel the weight. I feel the weight. There’s sorrow that comes my way, but it’s all twisting on the inside. But these men have been trained to be who they are in these moments when they come.

Nick: Yeah.

Will: and there’s. And all eyes are on them. Right. So there’s no. You’re not allowed to show. I think, Jamal, all of that’s great. And I think the only question that I would throw your way. And this is not something that needs an answer now, but I think this is just the other thing to play with and think about as we go to work through the scene is I think that weight is absolutely the thing that is coming at him. And I think the question is, how aware is Bolingbroke at the beginning of the scene of the size of that weight and the true weight that that crown is going to bestow? And I don’t know. I mean, this is truly where, you know, this is truly up to interpretation. But think about that. Like, how is this. Yeah. How much does he learn about the burden of kingship over this scene? Would be the only question I have for you.

Jamal: But thank you for that question. That’s good. That’s the question.

Will: good. All right, Nick. beautiful work. Really crystal clear. I’m gonna say, just on a technical side, you were cutting in and out just a little bit. so I would just. If you’ve got any apps. It wasn’t to the point where it was like, distracting, but, I just wanted to flag it for you.

Nick: Yeah, let me try. Let me turn my phone off real fast just in case. sometimes it’s because I’m so far away, that it, that it happens occasionally. It was a bummer. I worked on one of these things and I went back and watched it again and I was like, oh, boy, I’m silent half of time, but hopefully, turning my phone off will help a little bit.

Will: Great, great, great, great. And again, it wasn’t to the point where I was like, where is getting in the way? But I just wanted to flag it. Yeah, I think I’ve got PTSD from, you know, in the heart of the pandemic. I did, I think probably three thirty Zoom reads, both with my own company and then with this really wonderful group called the Show Must Go Online by a guy named Rob Miles out of Edinburgh. and I was like, I found myself like, doing. I played Henry VI and a reading a part, Henry vi, Part two, with like, members of the Royal Shakespeare Company in the National. These, like, it was really cool to sort of be on Zooms with all these people who suddenly had nothing to do. But I had. Exactly. I had like the mother of all Internet breakdowns in the middle of a scene. And it, like, it lives in perpetuity on YouTube. You can like go and watch it and it’s like, it’s like it’s towards the end of the play when all the rebels are coming in. And, you can watch my poor castmates just sort of sitting there awkwardly, like we’re not reaching that level at all. But since that day, I’ve been hyper vigilant about this stuff. so really, really wonderful crystal work. I just want to know, how was that? It’s, open ended question, but just how was that? How? I guess. Well, I want to open it up. So anything that you wanted to talk about before and then also anything that occurred to you, actually speaking the words out and doing it from beginning to end for the first time?

Nick: Yeah, you know, I mean, I love the rehearsal room because these, you know, I’m a little bit familiar with this play and I’ve read it many, many times and I have a completely new opinion on it from this session, which is really, really neat. Lots, of things have changed. And I totally agree with you, Will, that these are equal weighted parts in this scene. Because Bolingbrook, though he doesn’t say as much, has as much lifting to do in a completely different way. And Shakespeare brilliantly balances that out. and I do feel like, as Richard is fluttering around the stage, a lot of the audience’s eyes will be watching for Bolingbroke’s reaction during all of these things as well. So he

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Nick: feels the weight of all eyes on him from the audience, just as the character feels the weight of all eyes on him from the kingdom. So it’s, you know, the guy. Shakespeare was good. He was good at this. Yeah.

Will: He may or may not have a future, but my toys, brother.

Nick: However, there is one thing that I’ve discovered since our last session and after reading this a little bit, is I do feel, in a way, and I understand how I used to think of Richard as sort of m. Mopping the floor with Bolingbroke during this scene, but now I find it incredibly uncomfortable listening. And now when. When Jamal read this, and it was great because I got to steal all of Jamal’s fantastic work from last time. So thank you. And you read it with this language, brother. Yeah. But you had this beautiful nobility when you read it. And I feel when it comes out of me, it’s, M. Methinks he does protest too much. Like, I do believe after looking at the scene again, that Richard maybe could have lived. And he seals his fate with so many words. You know, I think that if he would have just shut up in a couple of section of this, he could have survived. He could have made it. And this scene, in a way, he’s killing himself. And it’s really, It’s uncomfortable for me to watch. I don’t think I’ll ever look at this play the same way again, watching this scene, because I’m like, oh, man, stop it. Just stop it. Like, you think he does it.

Will: And again, like, these are. This is where I’m like, steal what’s useful. But it is a totally blank slate. Do you think he’s doing that? Like, I think this is a really interesting avenue of investigation. Do you think he’s doing it deliberately?

Nick: Honestly, I think he can’t help himself. the way that. I mean, I could see where you could. He could be making a specific choice and those lines to say, you know, and because he says Richard’s dead, but I’m not sure if it’s as much m. You know, like, there’s a lot of times where if Hamlet would have just shut up with Claudius, he could have lived on. Do you know what I mean? If the nurse and the friar would have shut up in Romeo and Juliet, Romeo and Juliet would be living in Siena with children, happily forever. You know, like. And I. For me, when I read this, it makes me uncomfortable. It makes me feel like Richard’s desire for an audience and for power. Like, you could play it as a choice, but for me, I feel this is a tragic scene. and this is the tragedy of Richard ii. I don’t know. I just feel like it’s a natural undoing of himself because, why does he keep talking?

Will: I think would be the question. And we don’t need to have an answer now. But if he is. Because I think you’re right. Whether, you know, he can. There’s. There’s multiple places in this scene where he absolutely has the option to shut the fuck up.

Nick: Yeah.

Will: And he chooses pain every single time. and so my question is. And I think this is, if you have an answer now, great. And if not, let’s just hunt for it. but the question. I agree. I think he absolutely talks himself into his grave in this scene. whether or not he is aware of what he’s doing is. Is something to play with. But why?

Nick: Yeah, like, you could play it if he made the decision before he goes in that he was gonna die. Or. Or maybe it happens in the middle somewhere where he just says, okay, this is it. Like, you know, I mean, there. There are. I think there are three ways to play it. Or you could play it where he just loses. He loses his grip on. On. On. I don’t know how to describe it. You know what I mean? He. He can’t help himself but dig his own grave in this scene, and it’s his.

Will: Yeah, well, I guess the only. The only thing that I would fire back is, like, how. And I don’t know how aware is he of the fact that he is digging his own grave? Does he think. Does he think that he is arguing his case? Does he think that he is, like, is he trying to. To win something? Or is he trying, like. And I don’t know.

Nick: I mean, he does say it. He does say, richard shall be in an earthy pit. But, the way that. And I don’t know if we were doing this show together, I would have to spend a lot of time making a decision on whether or not his choice, Whether he came into this scene expecting death.

Nick: Or. I mean, it could be that he came into the scene expecting to win everybody over, you know, and to bury Bolingbroke with his great mind, you know, and in a way, sometimes the youth of Richard ii, he causes himself a lot of trouble. You know, I mean, it’s one of the reasons that Richard went, you know, goes down in this play. but at this, at this point in the play, he’s. He’s made a turn,

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Nick: you know, he’s he’s grown up a lot. So I don’t know. Those are the questions that, that I would have to continue working on were I working on this piece. It’s kind of a never ending thing, but I do it. It feels cringy to me. It feels tragic. yeah, I want to tell him to calm down and let Bolingbroke speak and it, you know, but I understand his anger. It has been usurped, everything that’s been taken away from him. So.

Will: Well, I think, I want to get us back into the text because I think that these are all incredibly exciting avenues and incredibly sort of original avenues with which to, approach the scene. Because you hear, you hear the scene talked about in terms, in terms of its magnificence and you hear, you know, this. The language is often held up as being exceptional. And you’re right, like we have off. we do often think about this as Richard sort of mopping the floor with Bolingbroke and one last hurrah before he goes off and is killed or and is martyred. Right. But all of these interpretations allow Richard to preserve his status. And what is interesting about what you were talking about is that we are essentially not. I mean, not. You know, the only way I can think to describe it is like we’re essentially watching a guy have a meltdown, you know, that is, you know, that he falls. That we’re looking at someone falling apart publicly.

Nick: yeah, I feel like it’s about a scene about ego. You know, it has a lot to do about the power of the ego. And if he could, you know, if he could have held that back. But he’s so upset that this has been stolen from him. That which was ordained by God. m. And you know, the prayers, that. The prayers are pretty solemn that he makes. And the prayers are very, the lines are very specifically and beautifully written, you know, and I feel like when he’s, you know, he invokes God a lot and compares himself to Christ in. In many ways. So I feel like that he does. He doesn’t understand how this could happen. How could, you know, how could God let this happen to him? It’s almost like a Gethsemane moment, you know? Like, it’s interesting.

Will: Yeah, it’s excellent. all right, well, I’d love for us to dive back into. Well, Miranda M. I want to turn it over to you in a second just to hear any, any observations. The only thing that I want to like, throw at you, Nick, as we dive into the text. I think this is all great. And the thing that immediately leaps out to me and the only, the only like, note that I have for you at this point is I think that your, your handling of the text is crystal clear. It’s wonderful. And, what I love about the, the tack that you are describing is it gives us an opportunity for a lot of really exciting moment to moment decisions, right? That, that he. He is fighting those war. You’re giving yourself strong warring impulses, which is, which is great for drama because we love a messy human. but that you. That there is, that there’s. There’s the knowledge that at some point he should shut up and let Bolingbroke talk, but then the inability to like, actually put that into action and so, and, and, and, and throwing into that also into that sort of like the world’s worst cocktail, right? But it’s like you throwing into that you. The, the added agreement, the added ingredient of like the guilt of giving up, you know, because he does invoke God. And it is. I think it can be played as a tactic to try and legitimize himself. But I also think that it is a reminder of the pressure that this person who’s been on the throne since he was nine has perhaps really internalized. And there is a moment where it’s like, nay, if I turn my thoughts upon myself, find myself a traitor with the rest, it’s like, oh my God. Like, because I. There. The, the third part of this is, oh my God, what have I done? Like, what am I doing? Like, what are, what are the. What are the, like, ecclesiastical ramifications for this? And I don’t know, but that’s. That’s. I think all I would say is I would like. You can allow. I think you are a very clear and, the only word I can think. And it’s not accurate, but it’s very polished. You have a lot of polish to you as a performer, which is fantastic. And I think we can mess Richard’s hair up. A little bit.

Nick: Okay.

Will: In order to tell the story that you’re suggesting. Miranda, any thoughts?

Miranda: yeah, just a couple. Real quick. I’ve been thinking a lot this week about the duality of these two characters and just how wonderful this session has been to. To have you both switching. Switching roles, which just lends such insight into the characters and into the play and into the dynamic. And. And they really. They really are mirrors of each other in so many ways, I think that sort of comes to. To. To, A head in this. In this scene in particular, you know. Richard. Yeah. I love what you said, Nick, that he. He, It’s like he can’t help himself, you know? Does he know? Does he. You know, he knows. Maybe he knows that he’s just condemning himself, but he can’t help himself anyway. And. And whenever I would teach this play to undergraduates, we would always talk a lot about at what point does. Does Bolingbroke know, You know, decide

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Miranda: that he’s actually after the crown, you know, And. And at what point does Richard decide that he’s going to un. King himself? And I think. I think both of those, Again, that duality. Those conflicts really, Really come to fruition in this scene and in the image of the mirror especially. So. Great work. I’m loving listening to this.

Will: M. Beautiful work, you two. Yeah.

Will: All right, let’s dive back in. again, beautiful handling. the only thing I’ll throw you right at the top of this first speech, Nick, is, There’s the. I mean, we talk about. And we talked about this last week with Jamal, too, but that there are. Richard. Richard sort of continually chooses pain. and I think that it’s right here, right. That there is that moment of, like, he enters and is, like, suddenly faced to the entire. Like the whole. The whole court, right. This, like, wall of traitors, essentially. and to take it in. And he could. He could be very demure, very mindful. and instead. Instead he starts with, alack, why am I sent for to a king? Before I shook off the regal thoughts for. So I take. Feel free to take the only thing that is, like, take your time in. Especially in this first speech, right. In that moment to moment work. Right. I think that there is. Yeah, yeah. Take your time. And what am I trying to say?

Will: And play with making the decision to speak and making the decision to specifically take this more aggressive tack. And let’s just see how that sits on you. so, just like last week, Nick, just like with Jamal, I’m gonna ask you to literally exit. Take as much time as you need. Feel free to make Jamal and I wait as long as you want. and then come on. And take your time. And don’t speak until you. You feel like you have to.

Nick: Okay, Cool. Thank you.

Will: Sure. Thank you.

Nick: Alack, why am I sent for to a king before? I have shook off the regal thoughts wherein I reigned hardly, yet I learned to insinuate, flatter, bow and bend my knee, give sorrow leave awhile to tutor me to this submission. Yet I well remember the favours of these men. Were they not mine? Did they not sometime cry, all hail to me? So Judas did to Christ, but he in 12 found truth, and all but one I and 12,000 none. God saved the king. Will no man say amen? am I both priest and clerk? Well, then, amen. God save the king, although I be not he yet. Amen. if heaven do think him me to do, what service am I sent for hither?

Will: Good, good, Nick. Really nice.

Nick: Ah.

Will: Again, I want to draw your attention specifically to this phrase, sent for that you say a couple of times in the speech. And I think that that is if we’re talking about things that stick in Richard’s craw. I don’t know that Richard has ever been sent for in his life before. And so I think that there is. It’s. It’s interesting. We’re catching him at such. We’re catching him at such an interesting point because he has, again, Richard is the first person in the play to bring up the idea of him giving up the crown and. And. And. And. And. And giving it to Henry. But it’s one thing to say it’s like Lear, right? It’s one thing to like, talk about giving up power, and then it’s another to actually sort of like, experience power life where you’re not able to bring your hundred knights with you everywhere you go. Right? You know, suddenly Richard. Richard has deposed himself, and suddenly he is a person who can be summoned. and so I think that. I think that there’s. There’s pro. I think

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Will: what I’m getting at is. I think that there’s processing. I think that there’s. There’s a little bit room. I think you can really ask the question of what.

Nathan: What.

Will: What gives you the right. You know, I don’t. you know, and I think that his. His saving grace as a character, and I think maybe the one. The one reason why, we don’t write him up because he is a. I Mean, when we meet him, he’s a brat. and he’s sort of, I mean, God love him, but he kind of remains a brat right till his. Right till he dies. M. Profound. but, but he’s a brat. but, he is also. He has Hamlet’s curiosity. And he has the ability to interrogate a situation. Which I think really, and, I’m speaking in draft here. Like, these thoughts are truly occurring to me in the moment. But really sets him apart from everyone else that we meet in the play. Because everyone else that we meet in the play is all about take a position. Take a hard line position. this is right. That is wrong. I am York, you are Lancaster. Right. I know that’s a fast forward, but we’re sowing the seeds now. but Richard, right from the get go, he plays with things, even in his first scene. You know, those delightful, the delightful sort of like little, the playful rhymes he tosses off to his, you know, this we prescribe the no physician. You know, too deep malice, makes too deep incision. You know, he sort of dances along the tops of things. And I think that gets him into trouble. But it is also in this scene, it, it allows him, it is, it is, it allows him a sense of humanity. All this to say. I’m talking too much. All this to say, I think let the fact that you have been sent for stick in your craw and ask, really ask that question. technically, I think, before I have shook off the regal thoughts, Wherewith I reigned. I think right now we’re spending a little bit too much money on where we’re tripping ourselves up on the word wherewith, which is totally understandable. It’s one of those. Yeah.

Nick: You know, I, I, I have so much trouble saying wherewith. Like, my mouth just doesn’t want to do it. So I think that’s why I’m focusing so hard on it. Because I, I keep wanting to say wherein I reigned. So where, where with just. But yes, I understand. The pronoun is important. Right there, Irene.

Will: Absolutely. I totally, I totally get you. And the only thing I’ll say to that man is like, especially for now, take the pressure off yourself. If you accidentally say we’re in, it’s not a big deal. Right on.

Nick: thank you.

Will: If we hear I rained, that’ll drive the issue.

Nick: Great.

Will: and I think, give yourself time. Insinuate, flatter, bow, bend my knee. These are all of the things that other people have done to you your entire life. That I don’t think you’ve ever really paid attention to. You’ve never had to bend the knee to anyone. and it is interesting that, like, I don’t know, it’s not a very flattering portrait of being a subject. But. But let. Let each of those images land. and then I think let’s make sure again. These are. These are super, Nick. I want to triple reinforce. You’re doing excellent work. These are super nitpicky things. let you know, I just.

Nick: Along with what you said. I just noticed that I didn’t really scent. It bookends this speech. Like it’s in the. It’s sent for is in the first sentence and the last sentence. You know what I mean? So it’s all. I didn’t realize that until just now. So I get what you’re saying. Absolutely.

Will: Yeah. It’s the thing that. It’s the thing that. Well, and it’s the thing that starts this whole thing. Yeah, it is. It’s a bookend. make sure that we. Sorrow, give sorrow, leave a while. Think of sorrow as a proper noun as opposed to an improper noun. Sorrow is the person who will teach you how to do this.

Nick: Great. Okay.

Will: Yeah, Yeah, I think that’s all I have. it’s in a good spot. Let’s, let’s take it again from the top with just thinking about that and then we’ll. We’ll press on.

Nick: Okay. Alack, why am I sent for to a king? For I have shook off the regal thoughts wherewith I reigned. I m hardly yet have learned to insinuate, flatter, bow, bend my knee, Give sorrow leave awhile to tutor me to this submission. Yet I well

00:40:00

Nick: remember the favours of these men. Were they not mine? Did they not sometime cry all hail to me? So Judas did, to Christ, but he in 12 found Ruth in all but one, I in 12,000 none. God save the king. Will no man say amen? Am I both priest and clerk? Well, then, amen.

Nick: God save the king, Although I be not he and yet. Amen. If heaven do think him me to do what service am I sent for.

Will: Hither to do that office of thine own good will, which tired majesty did make thee offer the resignation of thy state and crown to Henry Bolingbroke.

Nick: Give me the crown here, cousin. Seize the crown here, cousin, on this side, my hand on that side, thine. Now this golden crown, like a deep well that owes two buckets, filling one another, the emptier ever dancing in the air, the Other down unseen and full of water that bucket down and full of tears am I drinking my griefs whilst you mount up on high.

Jamal: I thought you had been willing to resign my crown.

Nick: I am, but still my griefs are mine. You may glory in my state deposed, but not my griefs. Still am I king of those part.

Jamal: Of your cares you give me with your crown.

Nick: Your cares set up. Do not pluck my cares down. My care is loss of care by old care done. Your care is gain of care by new care won. The cares I give, I have though given away. They tend the crown, yet still with me they stay.

Will: Good, good, good, good, good, good. Before we go on, I just want to sort of unpack this chunk. Really nice work, you two. So give me the crown haircut and seize the crown. So you’re handling. You’re handling the sort of the shaking the crown, the baiting of Bolingbroke, really love in, a really lovely way. Nick on this side, my hand on that side, nine. So I think there’s. There’s a. I just want to sharpen up this shift. So, Nick, just like last week, Jamal wasn’t proceeding with the text until you put your hand on the other side of the crown, go ahead and do the same. And Jamal, take as much time as you need to grab the crown, but keep an eye on him. And again, it’s. Because it is Jamal talking about, like, balance of power, right? The moment that you. And it’s that sent for, right? Nick, you were sent for and now you are sending for him, right? So you’re not going to give it to him. You’re going to make him come and get it. So, Jamal, you are. It is a capitulation. so take as much time as you need to decide to do that. and then, Nick, once he has done that, you have him, and then you’re going to make your point. You’re not actually going to let go of the crown, right? Which is how you end up with the iconic image, on this side, my hand on that side, dying. Now, is this golden crown like a deep well that owes two buckets filling one another. So the thing to play with Nick and I, there’s no. There’s no specific answer, but. But why does he not let go of the crown, right? And why. Why does he want to make this point? And the question, too, and this is something we talked about loosely last week. is this conversation over the crown public or is it private? and it’s all choice. It’s all so I don’t even need you to tell me. I think just think about it and make a choice about whether. And you’ll have to help me, because it’s zoom. and that means that we’re sort of a lot of the tools that we would have at our disposal to tell the story are not at our disposal, but I think. But really do, like, think about awareness level, right on this side, my head on that side, died. Am I sending it to

00:45:00

Will: a room full of people who want me dead, or am I sending it to this one? This one person who, definitely has fucked me, but also is my cousin? yeah.

Nick: And I can tell you my thoughts. This, on this part changed as well, because I always saw it as a public thing, and now the more that I’ve read it, and from playing bowling for last week, it feels incredibly intimate. But I don’t. I don’t know if that’s the right choice or not, but I do, like. Like, in my. In my brain, if we were filming it, it would cut to close up on that section, you know, because I feel like it’s a negotiation between old friends all of a sudden. You know, this is where their. Their brotherly love almost comes out. It’s like a conversation that they may have had over a dinner at one point.

Will: Well, so I think this is great. And I think, again, there’s no right or wrong answer. It’s an extremely interesting, avenue of investigation. So let’s. Let’s go through the looking glass on this. but. But then I think this, to get just a little bit more specific, why are you, like, what. Why are you forcing him to listen? What are you trying to communicate to him, privately, as you have? and I think we can look at the. Let’s. I mean, the text may give us. So on this side, my hand on that side, thine now is this golden crown, like a deep well that owes two buckets, filling one another, the emptier ever dancing in the air, the other down unseen, full of water that bucket down and full of tears. Am I drinking my crease? So, I mean, it’s all clear in terms of the literal. Like, literally, you’re saying what?

Nick: Well, I’m, sorry. Just when you were thinking, when you were saying, I went back to last week in my head on Bolingbroke’s line, I thought you had been willing to resign. and I think that my. My, it’s the u. in Bolingbroke’s line that it’s not Richard’s line that convinces me of that intimateness, because he addressed. He didn’t say, I thought he had been willing to resign. It felt like. Like it had switched. So I feel like Richard’s taking it off of Bolingbroke. and so I don’t know, but he addressed a specific question to me. So Richard says, yeah, you can take my crown, but you can’t take my sadness.

Will: because you start the exchange, though.

Nick: So this first chime, with the other down unseen. And see, that feels public to me. It doesn’t feel private until after Bolingbroke speaks.

Will: Okay, great, great.

Nick: Specifically, the drinking my griefs while you mount up on high feels like it’s for an audience. And the language feels, stronger and more purple and more flowery during that section. And then the. This. The next section feels more down to earth to me. which, you know, it feels. I’m not sure, it feels less showy for. For an exchange. And they have this. This brilliant back and forth that they do right there.

Jamal: And that’s why the image, I feel, is so powerful, too, with the crown. Because rather, it’s private or public. You have this strong kind of face off that.

Nick: And they’re so close together.

Jamal: Yeah. Everyone is still seeing that publicly. And if you’re in a room with kings and they’re both, you know, what’s going on, whether you can hear or not, this community is feeling everything.

Nick: And they know the image is strong enough that the crowd doesn’t need to hear what they’re saying because they’re seeing them both holding the crown. So I think they would have an awareness of that.

Will: And the added tension to that, too.

Nick: Right.

Will: Is like you’re dealing with two kings, but you’re also dealing with two people. And you’re doing. Dealing with two people who are related to each other. And I think my question, Nick, mainly for you, is, are you. I guess to distill it down to. It’s sort of like core, is, are you trying to help Bolingbroke in this moment, or are you trying to hurt him? Because it is a warning. Is it meant in good faith, or is it meant to scare him?

Nick: I think that it feels to me like a moment of intimacy between two old friends where Richard is saying, are you sure you want to do this? do you know what you’re doing? Because I’ll tell you what, it’s pain. You’re looking at pain, and you can take this from me, and you have one. But, you know, and I think that maybe Richard truly Believes that he can convince his old friend. This is a terrible. This is all a terrible idea. in this section. And then Bolingbroke switches back, and I don’t know, if this is your choice, Jamal, but we can talk about it or not. But I feel like after Bolingbroke says, are you contented to resign? The crowd, it turns back to public. And I don’t know if that’s the right choice or not. But I feel like Richard on the. I know. No, I. That he switches back to playfulness. It’s like, you know, I heard a thing about Robin Williams. Whereas if he was talking to one person, he would be incredibly normal and incredibly deep.

00:50:00

Nick: And, And if another person came in, he would switch, and they would become an audience, and he would become a different person. And I could see it feels like a change when Richard goes. I know. No, I. For I must nothing be like, okay, now I’m playing for the crowd again. But I don’t know if that’s right.

Will: Well, it’s not. Again, it’s not right or wrong. Miranda, I’ll toss it over you. I just want to make one point that I think it absolutely can be that. But you are also speaking a profoundly. Like, you are also cutting to the core of the issue. For you personally. Not just the core of the issue for the country, but for you personally, it is a very vulnerable thing to say. For I must nothing be. like, it’s. It’s, you know. And it is a pun. I know. No, I. Like.

Nick: You’re right. So the switch. The switch to public would be now mark me how I will undo myself. Or even that could still be intimate. And then he could switch on. I give this heavy weight from off my head, and you can’t.

Will: You absolutely can. The switch can happen anywhere. Nick. The only thing that I want to say is that if you are. Because, again, it’s that thing with Robin Williams, too. Right? And I think part of what makes him such a compelling. I would have loved to see his Hamlet, to be honest. And I would have loved to see his Richard ii. Because something that Robin Williams had is. And I mean, I guess we didn’t learn this about him until it was too late, but the. The engine of his humor was such a profound sadness. and just this sort of. This deep well of. I don’t know, in everything. I watched the Birdcage the day that he killed himself. and even. I mean, the movie’s a delight from. From start to finish. but. And he’s and he is, he’s. He’s in top form. But there is, there’s. You get the feeling that he’s running away from something when he gets into that like extreme manic thing and that he had the ability to. In the tradition of the best fools, he had the ability to jump into play while speaking the most dangerous truth. And what is so what. You know, so I don’t want to say yes or no. Like let’s leave this an open ended question. You’ve got a bunch of great options, see what feels right in the moment. But I think the only thing that I want to say is if you are going to make. I know. No, I. For I must nothing be a public admission. Just know that it is a dangerous thing both in terms of the world of this play, because it means that God’s anointed is now nothing. And it is also, more potently, it is a dangerous admission for this man to say, I am about to lose everything that defined me. so it’s like it can be played, but just don’t lose that. Miranda.

Miranda: Yeah, just, just noticing this is such a dramaturgical picky point. But, but again I think the language is here to help us. You know, Richard. Richard goes suddenly into. Into rhymed couplets. That bucket down and full of tears. Am I drinking my griefs whilst you mount on high. And Bolingbroke, I thought you had been willing to resign. And Richard matches him. My crown I am, but still my griefs are mine. And so there they, they complete the rhymed couplet there. Richard comes in with another one depose and those. and. And again Bolingbroke tries again with your crown. And. And Richard is completing the couplet and, and continues. and then Bolingbroke doesn’t. Doesn’t match him there. Are you contented to resign the crown? And Richard has that, that final couplet in that devastating image as well as Will was just saying with, with B and the. And then he goes into the ritualistic. So maybe there’s. There’s something in there and in that rhyme scheme to, to think about and to help.

Nick: Absolutely. Yeah, I see what you’re saying. I think I know what I’m going to try. So I’ll give it a shot and we’ll see what happens.

Will: So let’s, let’s dial back. Let’s go from what. Where Feels good. Nick, where do you want to take it from?

Nick: do you. Where. Let’s see, where’s he grab the crown here? Well, we can Go from giving the crown if you want to. Jamal.

Will: M. Good? Yep.

Nick: All right. All right.

Will: When you’re ready, friends.

Nick: Give me crown. Here, cousin. Seize the crown. Here, cousin. On this side, my hand. On that side thine. Now is this golden crown, like a deep well that owes two buckets, filling one another the emptier ever dancing in the air, the other down unseen and full of water that bucket down and full of tears am I,

00:55:00

Nick: drinking my griefs whilst you mount up on high.

Jamal: I thought you had been willing to resign.

Nick: I cried, but still my griefs are mine. You may my glories and my state depose, but not my griefs. Still am I king of those part.

Jamal: Of your cares you give me with.

Nick: Your crown your cares set up, do not pluck my cares down. My care is loss of care by old care done. Your care is gain of care by new care won. The cares I give, I have though given away. They tend the crown, yet still with me they stay.

Jamal: Are, you contented to resign the crown?

Nick: I. No, no. Ay, for I must nothing be. Therefore, no, no, for I resign to now mark how I will undo myself. I give this heavy weight from off my head and this unwieldy scepter from off from my hand the pride of kingly sway from out my heart. With mine own tears I wash away my balm. With mine own hands I give away my crown. With mine own tongue deny my sacred state. With mine own breath release all duteous oaths, all pomp and majesty I do forswear my manners, Rents, revenues, I forego my acts, decrees and statutes I deny. God pardon all oaths that are broke. To me, God keep all vows on, broker M. Made to thee. Make me that nothing have with nothing grieved, and thou with all pleased that hast all achieved. Long mayst thou live in Richard’s seat to sit and soon lie Richard in an earthy pit. God save King Henry unking. Bolingbroke says. Sorry. God save King Henry Unking, Richard says. And send him many years of sunshine days. What more remains?

Will: Tremendously exciting man. Also, I think that’s what they used to call a Freudian slip. Right there at the end.

Nick: Right.

Will: But really exciting man. That was really great. just a couple technical things. We won’t go back. Just a clock for when we. When we hit it again. it’s just a scansion thing. My manners, rents, revenues. I forgot.

Nick: Oh, revenues. There it is. Yeah.

Will: Not a way to ever be pronounced, but it’s like it’s the Paramedes thing from Antony and Cleopatra. Right. It’s like.

Nick: Yeah. Ah, yeah.

Will: All right. revenues. and I think, I love and soon Lai Richard in an earthy pit, being sort of a more intimate moment. Just don’t rush through the line. Don’t swallow the line. I think you can. If you are. If you’re gonna make an intimate moment, you. You can just. You can luxuriate in that image a little bit. awesome, but great. All right, let’s press on. no more but that you read these accusations and these grievous crimes committed by your person and your followers against the state and profit of this land, that by confessing them the souls of men may deem that you are worthily deposed.

Nick: Must I do so? And must I ravel out my weaved up follies? Gentle Northumberland, if thy offences were upon record, would it not shame thee in so fair a troop to read a lecture of them? If thou, wouldst there shouldst thou find one heinous article containing the deposing of a king and cracking the strong warrant of an oath marked with a blot damned in the book of heaven. Nay, all of you that stand and look upon me whilst at my wretchedness doth bait myself. Though some of you with Pilate wash your hands, showing an outward pity, yet you pilots have here delivered me to my sour cross. And water cannot wash away your sin.

01:00:00

Will: Good, good, good, good. One more technical scansion thing. if thy offenses were upon record. As opposed to record.

Nick: Oh, okay. were upon record.

Will: And I think, just in terms of, like, just finding peaks and valleys, I think the. He does. Richard does find exceptional power, paradoxically, in. In the act of giving up the crown. Right. He sort of. He clothes himself in the full majesty. in his. It is in the full. In the full weight of his majesty in order to. To make a spectacle of himself. But, I do play with the idea that it takes it out of him, you know.

Nick: Oh, yeah. Absolutely remains.

Will: I think it’s okay. Am I done? And let. I think rather than sort of greeting the lecture of your offenses that you have to read out with exasperation, I think. Let’s see what happens. If that is the first thing that legitimately breaks your heart. It’s.

Nick: Oh, my sadness. Less. Yeah, I understand what you’re saying.

Will: What? It’s like, you know, that, like, it’s one thing. It’s. It is one thing for you to give up the crown, and it’s another thing for you to have to like public publicly humiliate yourself like that. And so it’s about those. It’s about those, like. You know, I think part of what makes this scene so outside of. Outside of interpretation, I think just textually, one of the things that I personally find so exciting about this scene for Richard’s journey is there are moments where he has like two or three times in this scene he has the rug pulled out from under him, and he goes into free fall and then he manages to like, pull himself out, you know, like he. From this place of like he’s having to like literally do the most humiliate. It is the most humiliating thing that could be asked of him in this situation.

Nick: And that would be fear. That would make him afraid for a moment. and I haven’t found that fear yet, in the scene. It’s funny because there’s not a lot of moments where he appears afraid, but it could be right there from Northumberland. And Northumberland seems to be the most vicious, most vicious anti Richard character.

Will: Oh, without a doubt. And it’s never explained. We never have like, outside of just like general like Northumberland sort of lists some like, generic grievances against Richard. But it is, you’re right, it’s like Northumberland is like fucking venal against Richard and we never fully understand why.

Miranda: It’s just the Percy’s, they were always rebelling, you know, they were always rebelling over the centuries. That’s my theory. Just had to add that.

Nick: Aren’t you a. Are you a Percy Will?

Will: Yeah, they’re shits.

Nick: There you go.

Will: Northumberland, my 21st great grandfather. But yeah, they’re shits. and now I’m living in a two bedroom apartment instead of, instead of Here we go anyways. But So I think, I think that’s great. I think that’s great. But then he manages what’s sort of like so frankly badass, right? I think where the badasseries to be found is like he. And where, like, it’s where he finds his courage, right? Because it’s not that. And I mean this is like. I think you. This has been. This is the phrase that’s been splashed on a thousand T shirts, right? But it’s like, it’s not. Bravery is not the lack of fear. Courage is what you do when you are faced with that kind of fear. And it is, it is. This is the moment where Richard is able to find courage, right? Because it’s possible that this is the first time he has felt this potent of fear in his life. And it is, it is, it’s. It’s fascinating and it’s so moving that time and again, when Richard is placed with his back to the wall, does he make a spectacle of himself? Yes. Is he a drama mama? Unquestionably. But he, he also does manage to turn it on the people who are coming for him. We see it here and we see it, we see it in, in the farewell with his, his wife, and we see it in his. In his death scene, you know, he kills three of the assassins who are after him. you know, so, yeah, again, it’s heart. It’s the tragedy of, like this. If this guy, you know, this guy. And we see it time and again in the whole history cycle, right, Like I just did Henry the Fourth part one. And the thing we talked about with that Hal Hotspur fight is they should never have been. Those two young people should never have been put in a situation where they had to kill each other. They would have, they would have, they would have done so much more together than either of them would have ever been able to achieve individually. But it’s like time and again, this system, right, of sort of total power being entrusted in one person and it’s based on hereditary, based on bloodline, as opposed to merit, right. Time and again we meet people who have so much

01:05:00

Will: raw potential, to be great people, to be great leaders, and they. And we see them develop it too late or not given or not give it, get a chance to develop it. Anyways, that’s. I’m off my soapbox. Let’s get back into it. So let’s, let’s just take that again, sort of thinking. Thinking about that. I’ll give you the tee up and then we’ll press on.

Nick: yeah, and just one more thing. I think the Gentle Northumberland is really interesting. That’s always the fact that he calls him Gentle Northumberland. And now with that direction, it would make sense to me that he’s negotiating at this point, and trying to make him see the error in his ways.

Will: Absolutely. Sorry.

Nick: I’ll give it. I’ll give that a try.

Will: Absolutely. It can absolutely be a plea. Absolutely. All right. No more.

Nick: Where do you want to start from?

Will: let’s go from what more remains. So the very last line of that nice big chunk.

Nick: Great. What more remains?

Will: No more. But that you read these accusations and these grievous crimes committed by your person and your followers against the state and profit of this land, that by confessing them the souls of men may deem that you are worthily deposed.

Nick: Must I do so? And must I ravel out my weaved up follies? Gentle Northumberland, if thy offences were upon record, Would it not shame thee in so fair a troop to read a lecture of them? If thou wouldst, thou shouldst find one heinous article Containing the deposing of a king and cracking the strong warrant of an oath, marked with a blot damned in the book of heaven. Nay, all of you that look upon me, all of you that stand and look upon me Whilst that my wretchedness doth bait its. Sorry. Nay, all of you that stand and look upon me, Whilst that my wretchedness doth bait myself, Though some of you with Pilate wash your hands, showing in outward pity, yet you pilots have here delivered me to my sour cross. And water cannot wash away your sin.

Will: My lord, dispatch, read o’er these articles.

Nick: Mine eyes are full of tears. I cannot see. And yet salt water binds them not so much to. But they can see a sort of traitors here. Nay, if I turn mine eyes upon myself, I find a traitor with the rest. I find myself a. sorry. Nay, if I turn mine eyes upon myself, I find myself a traitor with the rest.

Will: And I think. Slow down here. Because I think this is the other moment of real terror for Richard that it’s like there’s the fear of having to humiliate himself, and then there’s the full weight of what he has done.

Nick: Thank you. Okay. Mine eyes are full of tears. I cannot see. And yet salt water binds them not so much but that they can see a sort of traitors here. Nay, if I turn mine eyes upon myself, I find myself a traitor with the rest. For I have given here my soul’s consent to undeck the pompous body of a king made glory base and sovereignty a slave, proud majesty a subject state, a peasant, My lord. No, lord of thine, thou hot insulting man, nor no man’s lord. I have no name, no title, no, not the name was given me at the font, but tis usurped. Alack, the heavy day that I have worn so many winters out, and know nothing now what name to call myself. Oh, that I were a mockery king of snow, standing before the sun of Bolingbroke to melt myself away in water drops. Good king, great king, and yet not greatly good. And if my word be sterling, yet in England let it command a mirror hither straight. It may show me what face I have since it is

01:10:00

Nick: bankrupt of his majesty.

Jamal: Go some of you, and fetch a.

Nick: Looking glass Read o’er this paper while.

Will: The glass doth come.

Nick: Fiend, thou torments me ere I come to hell.

Jamal: Urge it no more, my Lord Northumberland.

Will: Commons will not then be satisfied.

Nick: They’ll be satisfied. I’ll read enough when I do see the very book indeed where all my sins are writ, and that’s myself. Give me that glass, and therein will I read no deeper wrinkles yet. Hath, sorrow struck so many blows upon this face of mine and made no deeper wounds? Oh, flattering glass, like to my followers in prosperity, thou dost beguile me. Was this face the face that every day under his household roof did keep 10,000 men? Was this the face that, like the sun, did make beholders wink? Is this the face which faced so many follies, that was at last out faced by Bolingbroke? A, brittle glory shineth in this face. As brittle as the glory is the face, for there it is cracked in an hundred shivers. Mark, silent king, the moral of this sport. How, soon my sorrow have destroyed my face.

Jamal: The shadow of your sorrow hath destroyed the shadow of your face.

Nick: Say that again. The shadow of my sorrow. Let’s see. It is very true. My griefs lie all within. And these external manners of laments are merely shadows.

Nick: O, to the unseen grief that swells with silence in the tortured soul there lies the substance. And I thank thee, King, for thy great bounty that not only gifts me cause to wail, but teaches me the way to lament the cause. I’ll be one boon and then be gone and trouble you no more shall I obtain it.

Jamal: Name it. Fair cousin.

Nick: Fair cousin, I am greater than a king. For when I was king, my flatterers were then but subjects. Being now a subject, I have a king to my flatter. Her being so great, I have no need to beg yet ask and shall I have shall, and give me le to go whither. you will so I were from your sights.

Will: Go.

Jamal: Some of you. Convey him, to the tower.

Nick: Good. Convey conveyors are you all Thus rise nimbly by.

Jamal: Wednesday’s next, we solemnly set down our coronation. Lords, prepare yourselves.

Will: Good. Lovely work to do. I didn’t want to stop you because you were on a roll and there’s a lot of really exciting stuff happening. Jamal, I want to just check in with you real quick because Bolingbroke sort of starts talk here at the end of the scene. and I thought everything you were doing was interesting and effective, and I just wanted to talk me through it. How Are things landing on you? How’s the journey going for Bolingbroke?

Jamal: You know, I’m gonna speak about the scene first, because there’s so many truths and contradiction that exist in this scene. And there’s something that’s happening for me as Bolingbroke and as Jamal, because I resonate with what’s happening in this scene in a visceral way, mirrors my life in some ways, but I’m not a king, but I am, And sometimes you don’t know what you’re saying. This is truly a mirror. What exists within

01:15:00

Jamal: Bolingbroke also exists in Richard. That also exists in everyone in the room. It’s the spiritual concept of I’m, Everything that I am and nothing at all in the same space and time is what’s loudest in the room throughout this scene. You can only catch that if you have resonance with it. And as I’m receiving Richard words, I am also having my own spiritual and physical experience. And as we have said throughout this whole rehearsal, I’m not speaking words, but much is being said and what’s being transferred back and forth. And so as this goes on and as I challenge myself to stay with eyes on Nick and to really just receive, something is happening to me physically, and it must be for Bolingbroke. In the scene. You feel it through your system. Your heart is awakened, a fight is awakened. And also this wildness up here is floating and swirling, and it just happens to you when you open the vessel, just to receive this moment that’s happening whether you want it to or not. I say this a lot in my own personal life, you know, in the state of the world we’re in, there’s nowhere to run and there’s nowhere to hide for anyone here. What is happening is happening, and we all will be here for it. And so I’m receiving all those truths is how I would put it with Bolingbroke. Yet he knows the clothing that he is putting on. It’s so interesting as Richard was going through deposing himself and taking off the crown and releasing himself with the scepter and everything like that, in my mind, I’m receiving it, and those things are coming to me as he is taking them off. And so literally, the weight, physically, as he takes them off, is sent to him. And that’s also the power that, you know, not just kings have. That’s the whole era of mankind, but all of us have these words, have power. And Richard, rather, he’s knowing this or decided, I love the conversation that was happening because I feel like all these things exist together. You know, these words have power, and they are shifting everyone in the room, and there’s nothing to know. There’s more to feel, really. and so that’s what’s happening for me. I’m feeling everything while also putting on this garment that I know I must. And I don’t not believe anything that he’s saying. But as great beings who take these seats, do they know that it can mean their death and it might be. And so you don’t take these seats to save your life is also think about the thing, about what you were saying, Nick, about surviving. I was, having this conversation today. I was like, I never think about surviving. I don’t think kings do. I think they’re doing what they have been trained to do, which is to be king until they die. And when you’re so conditioned in that way, you exist in that way. It’s your conditioning. And there’s also something beautiful in, not trying to survive. Because if your life has been to hold this seat since he was a child and this is what he was born into, we’re all born into a context. Bolingbroke was born into a context, too. There’s nowhere to run, there’s nowhere to hide. And even if you exile yourself, you still have to deal with yourself well.

Will: And what’s interesting to. I love everything you’re saying. What’s interesting to, you know, it’s that that conditioning that you were talking about is absolutely something that Richard would have had. And that sort of. That. That. That conditioning to sort of do. Do what you are supposed to do, whether or not it means your survival, is something that Richard would have had, but Bolingbroke is not. Was not born into that context. And so it’s. What’s interesting, too, is I think that, like. And you said, you talked at the beginning of the rehearsal about. And it’s something you come back to a few times, but this idea of, like, the receiving the weight, right? And I wonder if that. If that. If that isn’t part of that weight too. That, like bowling, like, Richard was trained from the age of nine to do this. And we are in the middle. And this, again, this is just something that’s occurring to me now. But we are in the middle of Bolingbroke’s initiation, right? And Bolingbroke’s training and his, you know, that realization that, like, that is going to be his reality going forward. so it’s interesting, and that’s.

Jamal: One of the things, too, because, like, when we think about the concept that we’re born into in the world, you’re born like we make kings. We make them powerful. We make them feel how they feel. It’s like we do this all through Shakespeare. Gentle Northumberland, like, we name people, so we all are born into this context within the roles that we play, whether we choose them or

01:20:00

Jamal: not, that creates the world as it exists, even as the king exists. And Shakespeare points at this, I think, all the time, which is why I’m always attracted to the maids and the fools and the other people. I’m not a Bible person at all. I’m, an everything is everything person. I read it all. But the meek shall inherit the earth. And so there’s something extremely noble in this worldly conditioning that puts kings on these pedestals. And everything is everything. In the tarot, the tower falling is a blessing. It’s not a curse. It’s a blessing because we built these things up on not sturdy ground. And so that’s why I say there’s so many truths and contradiction here that Richard is talking about. I can’t say that he knows it all, because I think there’s a space in between of knowing nothing where you do know it all is not in the mind.

Will: Well. And Richard more or less says that in his last scene, Right. Nor I, nor any man that but man is with nothing shall be pleased till he first be eased with being.

Nick: Being nothing. Yeah. Every time he tries to figure it out. Yeah.

Jamal: And every time he tries to figure it up out here, he’s like, oh, no, Nay, I’m the traitor.

Nick: Right.

Jamal: Every time the mind starts working, he said, wait, no, no. He goes back to the self. And so I just love that. So that’s what’s happening for Bolingbroke. I love. I love listening and receiving all of this. It feels great and magical and true.

Nick: Great, great.

Will: Yeah. And lovely work, man. All of this is coming through beautiful. so let’s. Let’s take a look. Nick. Ah. Again, really lovely work in this back half. I didn’t stop you because I didn’t really have any too much specific. Oh, my mouse has gone to sleep. There we go. I hate technology. this.

Will: I think that it’s. And I don’t know. I don’t know that I need a specific answer for this, Nick, but I think that there is. Feel free to make a meal out of taking the decision to ask for the mirror.

Will: let it. Command it, because it’s truly. To anyone who is not inside Richard’s head. And you. Do you explicate it. But to anyone who’s not in Richard’s head, the request for the mirror is a true non sequitur. And it is. It’s a moment where, like, everyone around him is like, I beg your fucking pardon, what? It’s the last thing that we would expect him to ask for. that it may show me what a face I have since it is bankrupt of His Majesty. So I, like, feel free to make a meal of it. And I think where does. And I think it. I really. Again, I’m sort of speaking in draft here, but I think it does come. It comes out of. It comes out of everything you’ve been saying before. Right. I like the heavy day that I’ve worn so many winters out. A. No, not now. What name to call myself, right? It’s like, who the hell am I? I need something concrete to hang on to. Give me. Give me something. But you can take your time. But, Go. Some of you fetch a looking glass reader. This paper. I know. I think it’s probably a technical thing, really. Jump on, fiend. Thou torments me ere I come to hell.

Nick: I know I keep missing that line. Yeah, absolutely.

Will: It’s okay. And. But I think it’s, you know, And I think. But I. And you can allow it to be, you know. He manages to find a certain serenity. But I think that’s, Again, Northumberland is the person who gets under his skin. So anytime. Anytime Northumberland is talking to you, it’s.

Nick: Just a scrolling issue because it’s at the bottom of the page. You know what I mean? So I totally get it. I’m like, oh, darn it. Because that’s the one cue that really has to be on top of it. Absolutely, yeah.

Will: And don’t beat yourself up. It’s something to work towards. If we don’t get it, that’s not the end of the world.

Nick: Right on.

Will: They shall be satisfied. I’ll read enough when I do it. Where all my sins are writ and that’s myself. It’s. This is. I love this line. I’ll read enough when I do see the very book indeed where all my sins are writ and that’s myself. And what I find so fascinating about this is that it is, I think, definitely the fur. Miranda, correct me if I’m totally wrong. Definitely the first and possibly the own. Well, no, I wasted time and now did time waste me. But it’s certainly the first time that we’re dealing with him taking accountability in any way. Like he is admitting to having sins.

Miranda: Yeah, for sure.

Nick: yeah. I think that’s probably why Shakespeare put in action right after that line with the glass entering so that the audience would have a moment to really soak that in. And I’ll take some more time with that. Now I realize that’s interesting because I’ve been rushing through that line.

Will: Yeah. Take some time with it. And I think let it be again, especially with Richard. And in this scene, feel free. If you think that something could be an in the moment realization, let it be. Okay.

Nick: it’s discovering about which lines are for the public and which lines slip out of him and which lines are for. You know, there’s. It’s easy to play this scene one in, you know, one way, all public. You know what I mean? But really there’s.

01:25:00

Will: Well, even if there’s layers. And again, like you’re, you’re. The two of you are absolutely right. We could, we could work on this for months. Right. Because the shadings in that too are so. Because it’s public and private. But then it’s like prepared or unprepared. And it can be the combinations there. And it’s like I can be speaking intimately and it can be very prepared and I can be speaking very publicly and it’s slipping out at me.

Nick: Right.

Will: So. So it’s like within. There’s still a ton of shading and variation. So I’m gonna say like in a minute we’re gonna go back and we’re just gonna do it straight through. and that’ll be pretty much more or less the last thing that we do before the Q and A. Because I think the scene clocks into just about 20 minutes. but, I would say like strong and wrong, I think. You know, don’t, don’t worry about getting like pick a lane and pursue it. And then if you feel the need to change it, just pull hard left. no, deeper wrinkle. Has sorrow struck. Yeah, I thought you handled this really well. again, similarly, a brittle glory shineth in this face. As brittle as the glory is the face. I think. A. Again, it’s so interesting, especially in incredibly verbose plays like this. Or Ah, Loves, Labor’s Lost also sort of jumps to mind. Like Shakespeare will often, always, will always put the most profound, sentiments in the simplest of terms. Right? So it’s like a brittle glory shineth. And it’s a short sentence, but it is Also. It is also the most profound truth that he has spoken. That it is like, Especially in this world. Right? I think there’s a. Jamal, I loved everything that you were talking about, and I. But I think it also speaks to a. It speaks to a contradiction in that, like, there’s. You said it yourself. I’m not a king, but I am a king. And I think that there is a difference between other people calling one one a person, a king, and having that sense of authority in oneself. And quite often in these plays, the person sitting in the throne is not the person who feels kingship in themselves. Right? like, again, legitimate kings we meet in this play. In these plays, Hotspur, Henry Percy is someone who has that kind of authority in them. Hal never does. Not even in Henry V. you know, I love the. There’s. You know, the. What I love about Henry V, too, is, like, you. Like the. Like. The chorus will often give you the most jingoistic version of events and then is immediately undermined by, like, what happens on stage. Right now, all the youth of England are on fire. Cut to, like, three old drunks in a bar, right? A little Harry in the night. He’s going around talking. And then what he does in the next scene is he steals a cloak from the oldest member of his army. He goes and he picks a fight with one of his, With. With one of his soldiers who is making some very valid points about the validity of the war. And then he complains about the fact that it’s all his responsibility. Right upon the king. Essentially translates to, why is this my job?

Miranda: You’re tough on Henry, Will. My m. Goodness.

Will: I know I’m tough on all of them. But I think that there is. But I think, like, that is an essential truth that these plays investigate. That, like, the glory of that crown is brittle, that assumed authority breaks so very, very easily. and how.

Miranda: I mean, what an extraordinary thing to be writing and playing upon a public stage. Except they didn’t, you know, and play this scene. And you can really. As we’re working and drilling down, you can really see why. I mean, this is subversive. Subversive stuff.

Will: Yeah, you know, it’s. It’s insane. I mean, it’s insane that this. This was performed during the year of the Essex Rebellion. It’s. It’s truly insane. but I think, in terms of, like, technically, Nick, give yourself as much. Like, I think, let yourself feel that truth, and then I think take your time to make the decision. As brittle as the glory is the face I Think we can safely assume that by the time that you have said that, you have made the decision to break the mirror.

Nick: Great.

Will: I have to go momentarily. I’ve accidentally locked Margaret out of the apartment. Apartment. So give me, one second and then I will.

Nick: Good, because I have a couple of questions for Miranda while you’re gone.

Will: Great.

Miranda: Good, Good timing.

Nick: You know, I see there’s. There seems to be elements of Hamlet in Richard. And I’m wondering, was Hamlet written before Richard ii?

Miranda: After. After.

Nick: After.

Miranda: Yeah.

Nick: So there’s elements of Hamlet for sure.

Miranda: You know, back, back, back in the day. I taught, I used to teach at Vassar College in Poughkeepsie. And the Shakespeare classes were one year, two semesters. Right. And we just, I mean, man, we read everything. It was just such a, such a blessing. But

01:30:00

Miranda: what I would often do would be follow the development of a protagonist, you know, from, from, you know, a play to play to play. So you get, you get Richard II and then. Exactly. You get Hamlet, who is smarter than Richard. and yet there’s a kinship there. And we see, I think we see Shakespeare just sort of working, working with these, I don’t want to say character types exactly, but, but as a, as a playwright, sort of developing these personalities, from play to play to play.

Nick: We’re talking about, some similarities between Richard and Hamlet. Well, we’re talking about similarities between Hamlet. M. Did I cut out?

Miranda: Yeah, but we got it. Yeah.

Nick: yeah, I was wondering if Hamlet was written before this or after Richard ii.

Miranda: It was after, yeah.

Nick: Cool. Very good to know.

Miranda: Yeah.

Nick: Okay.

Will: but it is interesting that both plays also sort of deal with botched hands off handoffs of power. well, in this, I mean, this would have been. It’s, it’s sort of crazy to think too, that like. And this again, I’m sort of like, Miranda, tell me if this is wrong. But it’s like when Richard, when Shakespeare’s career starts, Elizabeth is already old.

Nick: Right.

Will: So like for the whole first half of his career, there’s like, there must have been this unspoken question in the air of. For 10 years, who’s gonna take over? She’s gonna die sometime. She’s gonna die soon. Who is the next going to be?

Miranda: Yeah. You know, and of course she, she named James the first. some. But I, I would have to, I would have to look up exactly when that became official. But even when it did, I don’t think it was very reassuring to the British because they thought, well, you know, that’s Nice. But what. There’s no guarantees. We’re not going to be plunged back into these horrible religious civil wars and, and the persecutions that, that they didn’t do it under. Under Mary. So. I agree. I think there was just this profound unease, that can only have. Have grown, as she got older and, and older and this. And her death was imminent.

Will: And who is James gonna be? Didn’t we behead his mother?

Miranda: Well, she was a Catholic. And by the way, I think Elizabeth I. I really think she did not want to do that. It was bad. She was, she was her cousin. You know, they were. It was bad precedent, you know, to be beheading another monarch. But. But I think after the Babington conspiracy, I think Elizabeth had no choice.

Will: So. But that’s.

Nick: I also see similarities. Oh, sorry. Between this play and Amadeus. And I wonder how much Richard, had influence on young Mozart. And there’s a, you know, maybe a little Mozart Salieri balance. So I feel like the brilliant sort of. Of, you know, the way he dances around with language.

Miranda: It’s. It’s there. Says something very. There’s something very personal and also something sort of archetypal, I think, about. About the relationship between. Between Bolingbroke and. And Richard.

Nick: Yeah.

Will: Even Miranda, I had never thought about this, but even. Even hearing you. And I mean, I knew this, but hearing you describe Mary Queen of Scots as Elizabeth’s cousin who she had murdered, it’s. I mean, I am Richard. II know, you’re not that. But more. More accurately, I am, Henry Bolingbroke. No, you not that.

Nick: Because.

Miranda: No, you’re not that.

Nick: Yeah, well.

Miranda: And of course, you know that there, There was a belief that. That as much as Richard, as poor a king as he had been, he was still the king. And this just sets in motion. And this is Tudor propaganda, but this just sets in motion this. This line of, failed kings, you know, that finally has to be resolved by Henry Tudor.

Will: excellent friends. I want us to go back and do it again. I’m just sort of scrolling through real quick just to make sure I didn’t, miss any notes. I think again, Nick, just another moment of decision. Right. It’s funny that like causes me the way to how to lament the cause. I’ll beg one boon and then be gone and trouble you no more. Shall I obtain it. Name it for a cousin. He like, he always chooses pain like you. You. Bolingbroke has given you an out. It’s like, Shall I obtain it? Name it? Fair cousin, you could and should just say, I want to go. But instead you decide to once again mock him. Fair cousin, I am greater than a king, for when I was a king, my flatters with intimate subjects. So again, as, as you, know, I’m gonna ask you to just sort of like make some strong decisions as we go back and do it again. But, but is that a, can he not help himself? Or is that like, you know, what is where?

Nick: If he would have said something different, if he wouldn’t have gone to the tower. I wonder, like if, you know, I wonder if he would have kept his mouth shut, if he would have had a better outcome at the end of the scene. But we’ll never know.

Will: I don’t know. And I mean, that’s a question for full production and for Jamal’s playing. And Jamal, make whatever decision feels right to you in the moment. I want to keep this as non prescriptive as possible. but, but it is. He takes that. Fair cousin and then. And this,

01:35:00

Will: you know, it’s a very, it’s, it’s, it’s very well structured and it’s very, you know, it’s very witty. But he, he really does, he really does dig his own grave. whether you go, oh, good, convey. So finally, conveyors are you. All that rise thus nimbly by a true king’s fall. Don’t. I’m gonna take the pressure off of you don’t feel like that needs to feel like an example exit line. Because you’re delivering it well, but you’re pushing just a little bit right now.

Nick: Sure, yeah, I recognize that.

Will: And so I think, you know, let it be a moment, you know, that, oh, you can take your time with it and just let it, let it happen and make a decision. I would say make a decision about who specifically you are communicating to and on which parts of the line. Right. And there’s a lot of. See, again, I don’t want to, I want to leave this as non prescriptive possible. See what occurs to you in the moment and give yourself time, as we’re doing it, to let it be what it is. But like, it’s those levels of like, am I speaking just to him? Am I speaking to the whole room? And is that, Is it like, Is the whole couplet just a one person? Is the whole couplet just a part? One room? Is part of it to him? And then does it expand or does it just start out here and then contract whatever feels right in the Moment. I want us to go through from the top. So I’ve talked enough. the two of you are doing absolutely stunning work. strong and wrong. Go for broke. Nick. let’s all get back up to the top of the scene. and then, Nick, make an exit. And at the end of the scene. Nick, go ahead and. Yeah.

Nick: All right, so we’re.

Will: Everyone, everyone back at the correct place. The lack. Why am I said four to a king? Good, good, good, Nick, Good. All right, Nick, exit. And when you’re ready, come on in. Start us off.

Nick: Alack, why am I sent for to a king? Before I have shook off the regal thoughts wherewith I reigned, I hardly yet have learned to insinuate flatter, bow, bend my knee, give sorrow, leave a while to tutor me to this submission. Yet I well remember the favors of these men. Were they not mine? Did they not sometime cry, all hail to me? So Judas did to Christ. But he in 12 found truth, and all but one I, And 12,000 none. God saved the king. Will no man say amen? am I both priest and clerk? Well, then, amen. God save the king. Although I be not he, and yet all men of heaven do think him me to do what service am I sent for hither?

Will: Do that office of thine own good will, which tired majesty did make thee offer the resignation of thy state and crown to Henry Bolingbroke.

Nick: Give me the crown. Here, cousin. Seize the crown. Here, cousin. On, this side, my hand on that side. Dying now is this golden crown like a deep well that owes two buckets, filling one another, the emptier dancing in the air, the other down unseen, full of water that bucket down and full of tears am I drinking. My griefs was you dance

01:40:00

Nick: up on high. I thought you had been willing to resign my crown. I am, but still my griefs are mine. You may my glories and my state depose, but not my griefs. Still am I king of those part.

Jamal: Of your cares you give me.

Nick: With your crown your cares set up, do not pluck my cares down. My care is loss of care by old care done. Your care is gain of care by new care won. The cares I give, I have though given away. They tend the crown, yet still with me they stay.

Jamal: Are you contented to resign the crown?

Nick: I know no I, for I must nothing be. Therefore, no, no, for I resign to thee. Now mark me how I will undo myself. I give this heavy weight from off my head and this unwieldy scepter from my hand the pride of kingly sway from out my heart with mine own tears I wash away my balm. With mine own hands I give away my crown. With mine own tongue deny my sacred state. With mine own breath release all duteous oaths, all pomp and majesty I do forswear my manners, rents, revenues I forego. My acts, decrees and statutes I deny. God pardon all oaths that are broke. To me God keep, All vows unbroke are made to thee. Make me that nothing have with nothing grieved, and Thou with all pleased that hath all achieved. Long may thou live in Richard’s seat to sit, and soon lie Richard in an earthy pit. God save King Henry. Unking, Bowling. Unking, Richard says. And send him many years of sunshine days. What more remains?

Will: No more, but that you read these accusations and these grievous crimes committed by your person and your followers against the state and profit of this land, that by confessing them, the souls of men may deem that you are worthily deposed.

Nick: Must I do so? And must I ravel out my weaved up follies? Gentle Northumberland, if thy offences were upon record, would it not shame thee in so fair a troop to read a lecture of them? If thou wouldst, thou shouldst find one heinous article containing the deposing of a king, and cracking the strong warrant of an oath, marked with a blot damned in the book of heaven. Nay, all you that stand and look upon me, whilst that my wretchedness doth, bate myself, though some of you with Pilate wash your hands, showing it out outward pity, yet you pilots have delivered me to my sour cross. And water cannot wash away your sin.

Will: My lord, dispatch. Read o’er these articles.

Nick: My eyes are full of tears, I cannot see. Yet salt water binds them not so much, but they can see A, sort of traitors here. Nay, if I turn mine eyes upon myself, I find myself a traitor with the rest. For I have given here my soul’s consent to undeck the pompous body of a king made glory base in sovereignty, a slave, proud majesty, a subject to state, a peasant, my lord. No, lord of thine, thou hot insulting man, nor no man’s lord. I have no name, no title, no, not that name was given

01:45:00

Nick: me at, the font. But tis usurped. Alack, the heavy day that I have worn so many winters out. And no, not now, what name to call myself. Oh, that I were a mockery King of Snow, standing before the son of Bolingbroke. To melt myself away in water drops. Good king, great king, yet not greatly good. And if my word be sterling, yet in England let it command a mirror hither straight. That it may show me what face I have. Since it is bankrupt of his majesty.

Jamal: Go some of you, and fetch him a looking glass.

Will: Read o’er this paper while the glass doth come.

Nick: Fiend, thou torments me ere I come to hell.

Jamal: Urge it no more, my Lord Northumberland.

Will: Commons will not then be satisfied.

Nick: They shall be satisfied. I’ll read enough. When I do see the very book indeed where all my sins are writ, and that’s myself. Give me that glass, and therein will I read.

Nick: No deeper wrinkles yet? Hath sorrow struck so many blows upon this face of mine. And made no deeper wounds? O flattering glass, like to my followers in prosperity, thou dost beguile me. Was this the face that every day under his household roof did keep 10,000 men? Was this the face that, like the sun, did make beholders wink? Is this the face which faced so many follies. That was at, last outfaced by Bolingbroke? A brittle glory shineth in this face. As brittle as the glory is the face. For there it is cracked in an hundred shivers. Mark, silent king, the moral of this sport. How soon my sorrow hath destroyed my face.

Jamal: The shadow of your sorrow hath destroyed the shadow of your face.

Nick: Say that again. The shadow of my sorrow. Let’s see. It is very true. My grief lies all within. And these external manners of laments Are merely shadows to the unseen grief. That swells with silence in the tortured soul. There lies the substance. Huh? And I thank thee, King, for thy great bounty. Not only gifts me cause to wail. But teaches me the way how to lament the cause. I’ll beg one boon and then be gone and trouble you no more. Shall I obtain it?

Jamal: Name it. Fair cousin.

Nick: Fair cousin, I am greater than a king. For when I was king, my flatterers were then but subjects. Now, being now a subject, I have a king. To my flatterer, being so great, I have no need to beg. Yet ask and shall I have.

Jamal: You shall.

Nick: And give me leave to go with it, whether you will. So I, were from your sights.

Jamal: Go, some of you. Convey him to the tower.

Nick: Convey, good. Convey. Conveyors.

01:50:00

Nick: Are you all that rise thus nimbly by a true king’s fall?

Jamal: On Wednesdays next, we solemnly set down our coronation. Lords, prepare yourselves.

Will: Beautiful work, you two. I’ve got nothing more to say, and I Think we’re pretty much out of time.

Nick: Just.

Will: It’s been a pleasure and an honor.

Miranda: Great. Yeah, that was great.

Nathan: It was really great. we can talk a little bit if people have a few minutes. You know, want to be respectful of everybody’s time. Of course, if, you need to run off, you have other commitments. Not a problem. but yes, a. Ah, really, really great session. And just, will thank you for the idea of, you know, having, these guys kind, of go back and forth with the parts. Ah, I think, it really. Not only, I think, does it illuminate different things about the role, about the two roles, I should say, because, you know, you just inevitably get people with different perspectives seeing different things. And so it brings up items that both of you can talk about and all of you can talk about. But,

Will: But then you.

Nathan: You get this glimpse of, or you get this viewing of different kinds of Richards just because of people’s inherent personalities.

Nick: It’s.

Nathan: It’s not a right or wrong or. Or whatever. Just what Jamal brings and what Nick brings to Richard or bowling broke. You know, you just,

Nick: It.

Nathan: It’s just really fun as an audience member to see different qualities and different things, brought to him. And you know, in the first session, many of us were talking about versions of this we, may have seen. And you know, see, they’re just as many actors as would play the part are those kinds of, variations and number of opportunities to see different kinds of Richard. So, I think it was really exciting, to work, you know, work this way. And you know, through a lot of the conversation tonight, it started when you guys were, you know, will you brought up the point of like, you know, what. What motivates, Richard to keep talking. And there’s almost this element, you know, this is how we all kind of operate. If you try to relate it to something we can, maybe more easy, more tangibly grab onto. And I, And I just had this moment of thinking about, Steve Jobs being let go of Apple, you know, when he was first fired by the board. And, Richard is obviously a very different type of character than Steve Jobs, who was a bit of a tyrant, by all accounts, people who worked for him. but you imagine this situation of like, okay, here’s this guy who, you know, he. He’s the king, for all intents and purposes of Apple of this guy, and we’re going to fire him. And what is he going to do? How is he going to react? Like we’re. None of us have been in this situation before of like, this guy was king, but he’s not going to be king anymore. So there’s just like this tremendous. The word that came to me was this tremendous sense of awkwardness of just like, who, like, who says anything next? Like what? And it’s kind of waiting for Richard to lead. The tone of like, what is he gonna do? And then. And obviously a lot of different characters in Shakespeare’s plays, keep talking for different reasons. Whether it might be rage or to avoid pain or you know, different things. But it’s just such a fascinating and. And of course Shakespeare does this. He puts us on the highest level of like, yeah, King leaving, like stepping away from this God given, role.

Will: It’s.

Nathan: But. But it’s still on a very personal level. Like we don’t know what’s going on. We’ve never been in this situation. And what is this guy gonna do? Like, is he gonna totally change? You know, it’s just, just fascinating. Here I am talking, on and on, but my motivation is ah, ah, just curiosity and passion for the material. what I do want to ask all of you guys who, Group. What I want to ask the group, is, you know, were there, were there one or two specific things that you feel like you took away from, working on this scene in particular about either the play as a whole or the character, one of the two characters. Nick, I know you mentioned you talked a little bit about like just how your perspective has changed on the play a lot working on this. but if anybody wants to field that question, whether Nick and Jamal or, or Miranda or Will, if anyone wants to jump in with their, you know, anything that’s changed for them or shifted for them?

Jamal: Well, I don’t know if this is a change, but an extension. I think like there’s something that happens in this piece with Richard where he takes ownership of all that he feels and all that he’s experiencing. and I think that that’s just powerful. You know, I think we cast on these beings

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Jamal: to be above humanity.

Nick: Right, sure.

Jamal: Regardless of what seat you sit in, you are a, ah, human too. No matter who or what God ordained you or bloodline.

Nick: Right.

Jamal: Are a, human. And there’s something extremely human in this exchange. You know, if we were in a different time, I’m pretty sure and Richard didn’t talk so much, he would have been in therapy for like the next couple of years processing all these things. But in Shakespeare this is what the therapy is, you know. And so that just, that goes with me. Like, these sorrows are mine. Golden Brook says it’s mine. Like, comes with who I am, what I choose to believe, what has conditioned me, it becomes mine. Whatever the weight, whatever the end result. And so I’m just leaving with that. as we are in a time where I think so many people are like, trying to access their emotions and.

Nick: Own them and it’s hard.

Jamal: It’s just hard. We see a king do it and it’s difficult to do it. It doesn’t make sense. Sometimes it doesn’t have to make sense. and so I’ll just leave with that. It doesn’t all have to make sense, but feel deeper than what makes sense.

Nathan: Well, and on that point, I think as we talk about the awkwardness and the pain, how many people in quote, unquote, real life wouldn’t speak to that in the moment? And, and that’s exactly what Richard does. He, he, you know, he says exactly what he’s feeling. When in, you know, most of our day to day lives, if we got into a really uncomfortable situation, it’s like, okay, I’m going to try to extract myself as quickly as possible and just, you know, get out of this. And he’s like, no, I’m really going to face this and, and really tell you exactly what I’m feeling. And like you said, he probably, probably saves a lot of money on the therapy sessions that he doesn’t get to go to.

Nick: He gets it all.

Will: One line item for assassin as opposed to like multiple line items.

Nathan: Exactly.

Nick: Yes.

Nathan: Yeah, yeah, yeah. anyone else wanted to share their, their thoughts or, yeah, experiences.

Will: I’ll jump in very briefly just because the only thing that I have to say, is that this was just sort of like a wonderful reminder that these characters don’t exist in a vacuum like that. The texts truly blueprints. And Bolingbroke only exists when someone is playing him and Richard only exists when someone is playing him. And that sort of the, I don’t know, the wonderful surprise is that these characters can totally trans, totally transform based on, based on who’s playing them. And watching the two of you, come at these characters from, with. From very, very, very different starting points has been really exciting. So that’s all.

Nathan: And. And I’ll. I’ll say in my memory, this is. This is the first session 

02:00:00 

Nathan: where we really spoke, where you guys really spoke so much about personal or private versus public moments. I mean, of course, it can come up in a lot of different scenes. We did the Try, you know, the part of the trial scene from Winner’s Tale. But. But, you know, And I think that that lends itself to the beauty of this work, that there can be so many interpretations, and each combination of actors and artists can figure out, well, what are private? What are public moments? And, you know, where does the familial relationship come out more? And I think that was just really, engaging to, observe and to listen to you guys kind of talk about. Because just. Yeah, it just allows the scene to just come to life in so many different ways. So. Yes. Yeah. it was great. Anyone else?

Nick: I really want to play Bolingbroke. I could totally tell after this. I keep thinking about that character. It’s funny. And, I just. I find it so fascinating. I’ve gone back and looked at him, and I’ve been like. I never realized until this session, the weight of that character before. I’ve always paid so much attention to Richard.

Nathan: Sure.

Nick: And, after working on this scene, it’s opened up a whole new doors. I. Because he doesn’t say as much, but they’re, you know.

Nick: Like Will pointed out, there is so much happening with him.

Nathan: Sure.

Nick: And I love what you said, Jamal, about the weight of the crown being put on him and that. That this gave me this image of physicality and the. You know, this. He carries a whole new weight that he didn’t have before, you know, and that Richard places upon him. And Richard does it with the lines. But.

Nathan: Oh.

Nathan: Yeah.

Nick: It’s just. There’s so much good stuff happening.

Nathan: Right. And it’s the same question of why does Shakespeare not give Bolingbroke as much to say, you know, what’s. What’s feeding that? What’s going on with him internally that he. You know. And, you guys did talk about that a bunch. So it’s. Yeah, there’s just a lot of. Lot of great questions for actors, and directors and artists to wrestle with. Miranda, was there anything you wanted to add? I don’t want to put you on the spot.

Miranda: No, not at all. Just,

Miranda: This just confirms everything I always believe about Shakespeare. Following up from Will, what Will was saying, just the plays really aren’t complete until they’re being performed. And, Jamal, I loved what you said about how. How Bolingbroke, of course, isn’t just. Just standing there. You know, he’s receiving all this. This. This verbiage coming from. From Richard and what is. What is happening for him in that. In that moment. And, again, I said this the first or second session maybe, but, the personal is political. That’s, that’s what I always think of with these. With these history plays. And we cannot forget the familial relationships. Even though, you know, sometimes we’re thinking, oh my God, how. How are you related again? And wait, another Harry, another Edward. But, but. But it really pays the effort to try to just master who these relationships were or who these people were in relationship to each other. Because that, That I think, really offers us such a. Such a wonderful way into the texts. So thanks everybody. I really enjoyed this.

Nick: Thank you.

Nathan: Yeah, yeah. Thank you. Thank you to all of you. Yeah, no, this was a wonderful session. Really, really great work. Even in kind of a compressed, time, than some of the other groups, just so, so deep. So rich. and I’m not just saying that I really, really enjoy it. These are, every session, every workshop series is another and I love them all, but this one was equally wonderful. and yes, for those, for those watching, you know, I hope this really inspired you to, you know, go run with these characters, you know, start to explore them and, you know, even taking a look at other scenes and what’s going on there and when do people talk and not talk and it just. There’s, you know, again, there’s an infinite number of choices you can make, but make them real. You know, make these real characters real people. and, again, you can go back, check out, you know, the previous weeks, check out all of our other sessions. You can support us on Patreon. That would be. Helps, us kind of keep the administrative lights on and allows us to keep this series going. We’re excited, you know, to keep going in 2025. I just want to thank again Nick and Jamal and Miranda and Will, for your, time and effort and energy, on this. It’s, always, always great to see a, very talented, group of actors, My earbud. earbuds, failing just at the very end here. But, but, Anyway, really, really thank you guys all so much for, your, attention and energy and output, over the weeks and can’t, wait to see you back in the rehearsal room 

02:05:00

Nathan: sometime soon. So thank you again, everybody, have a great night. And, we’ll. We’ll do it again sometime soon.

Miranda: Thanks, Nathan. Thanks, everybody.

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